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A Glossary Question

Discussion in 'Beginner and Creation Help' started by Drakaina, Jun 27, 2016.

  1. Drakaina

    Drakaina Dragon Kitty Tulpamancy System Is a host

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    I've seen this term before, but it's not in the main terminology page, and not in the linked plurality glossary. What does endogenic mean? Googling it turns up computer information, which I can't seem to translate to how that works plurality wise. :P
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2016
  2. Watcher

    Watcher Somewhere Between Motivated and Cold

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    It's a word for systems and subsystems that aren't formed through trauma. More or less an umbrella term, encompassing systems that were born that way from birth/"natural" systems, soulbonding systems, tulpamancy systems, and many more that don't fit the criteria of DID or OSDD. :)
     
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  3. Drakaina

    Drakaina Dragon Kitty Tulpamancy System Is a host

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    Thanks, Arcana. That it's a sort of umbrella term clears up why I couldn't deduce it entirely on my own. I couldn't find the common thread between the systems using it. I was looking too hard for details and missed the bigger picture. ^^
     
  4. FallFamily

    FallFamily Forum Goddesses Administrator Moderator Plural System Mixed-Origin System

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    [Tri] We probably should add it to the glossary as well as traumagenic if it isn't already there. Shard-seeding and shard-feeding probably need to be added too, but not as importantly.
     
  5. Max

    Max Grasping at Clouds

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    I have no idea what shard-seeding and shard-feeding are, so I would love to see those
     
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  6. Falah

    Falah aka the Chiaroscuro

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    @FallFamily, @Arcana That is odd. I had always heard it used as a replacement for the word "natural" in "natural multiplicity", which does not encompass tulpamancy. Namely, it was coined by a natural multiple system for that purpose. Tulpamancy is often considered its own field apart from traumagenic (forming through trauma) and endogenic (simply forming without anything to induce it).

    That being said, it is an odd category. We generally separate endogenic multiplicity and tulpamancy for bookkeeping purposes, as tulpamancy systems have a word to describe their exclusive origins--while if endogenic was used to refer to tulpamancy as well, those who form outside of tulpamancy and trauma would be left with no word to describe themselves.

    -- Architect
     
  7. Drakaina

    Drakaina Dragon Kitty Tulpamancy System Is a host

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    This was the impression I got. I tend to set tulpamancy, soulbonding, and daeminism as different from, what I've always just called "true" multiplicity. Since the 3 listed before involve creating an entity, and to my understanding "true" plurality doesn't, that seems like a difference meriting distinction.

    I'm sure there is a better terms but until I learn it I refer to non-created systems as "true" multiples. XP


    Slight side comment, this discussion has piqued my geek interest. I love etymology. I've devoted too many brain cells to remembering nonhuman history of terminology. Now I get to learn more again with plurality. ^.^
     
  8. Watcher

    Watcher Somewhere Between Motivated and Cold

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    That's true. Exactly whom it refers to seems to differ from space to space, from what we've seen. Or it's just cognitive parsimony on my part screwing things up as usual.
     
  9. Peregrine Pack

    Peregrine Pack Pack o' Boys DDNOS/OSDD System

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    Quick question, do words like traumagenic and endogenic (with the meaning of arising naturally, without trauma) apply to median systems, or only multiple systems? My confusion arises from the apparently common usage of "endogenic multiplicity" versus "endogenic medianship". Does the word "multiplicity" encompass medianship in this usage?
     
  10. FallFamily

    FallFamily Forum Goddesses Administrator Moderator Plural System Mixed-Origin System

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    [Tri] We mainly use endogenic to replace "natural systems" since the latter has certain connotations. But we have seen it used other ways.

    @Peregrine Pack

    Those terms do include median and multiple systems. Multiple is one of those words that has different meanings in different contexts. It is a topology just like median and singlet, but it is also the general term for more than one consciousness in a body, and sometimes it is used to mean all non-created kinds of plurality.
     
  11. AGGuy

    AGGuy Professional Pancake Multiple System Is a systemmate

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    I doubt I'm the only one who wonders if all these words, the meaning of which has partly been highly diluted, are even of much meaning anymore.
    At least in some cases, due to highly diluted meanings and definitions, definitely not.
    And arguably also not in many other cases, simply because there's so much technical term mumbo-jumbo in there that, for the purpose of using these words to explain to someone what you are, it's really kind of pointless in not all, but many cases.

    I mean, hell - there's so many of these words (half of them useless), and Rina and I still couldn't tell you any sort of name or term for what kind of system we are aside from the vague umbrella term "plural system", and that's completely ignoring her whole subsystem thing.

    My point?
    Well... I guess I wish this whole community would have a better and more effective way of naming things and handling its glossary, is all I'm saiyan.


    Greets,
    AG
     
  12. Drakaina

    Drakaina Dragon Kitty Tulpamancy System Is a host

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    To spin off of the topic with another glossary question, I've seen entities sharing a body referred to as "plural systems" and "multiple systems", is there a difference between the meaning of these two terms?


    If plural terminology is anything like it is in the nonhuman community, I think a lot of people will say they do have a handle on their glossary. It's the people who want to force a word to fit them, or people using plurality as a fad and don't bother to learn about it, who dilute a teen's meaning, instead of finding the right word for them. And there's very little anyone can do about that other than to stick to their guns.
     
  13. Mel

    Mel Climbed Over the Fourth Wall

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    "Plural system" is inclusive of multiple systems as well as median systems, whereas "multiple system" exclusively refers to systems whose members are separate and distinct.

    As for my take on terminology... we are not very picky about words so long as we can deduce the underlying meanings. Terminology varies and changes a lot depending on the nature of (sub)culture and context, honestly, and we consider labels to be tools and not absolutes. Though I am biased myself, as I eschew most of the labels presented to me.
     
  14. Drakaina

    Drakaina Dragon Kitty Tulpamancy System Is a host

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    So a system consisting of a host, a daemon, and a median facet would not be a multiple system then, did I get that right? I just want to be sure, sometimes I unintentionally overlook that median facets (and daemons) are not technically their own people because of how like individuals they seem.

    ...that sounds really terrible in words, I hope no one takes that offensively, I certainly don't mean it that way. XP
     
  15. Mel

    Mel Climbed Over the Fourth Wall

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    Mmm... whether they consider themselves their own people or not does depend on the system. For instance, some median facets/system mates could consider themselves individual, but a part of the host as well, so things are not always cut and dry. That is a bit of a digression, however, and yes, they would be a median system with a daemon, or a median demian. Being median, the hypothetical system in question would fall under the plural descriptor, and whether daemons count as plural depends on the circle, but they are usually not considered part of plurality by default if I remember correctly.

    This got more convoluted than I expected. Whew.
     
  16. AGGuy

    AGGuy Professional Pancake Multiple System Is a systemmate

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    Oh. Then "multiple system" would actually be the correct term for us...
    ... good to know, actually. xD
    I wasn't really sure about the whole difference between "plural" and "multiple" either.


    Greets,
    AG
     
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  17. Drakaina

    Drakaina Dragon Kitty Tulpamancy System Is a host

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    Thanks for explaining that, Mel. I work on the (probably oversimplified) definitions for most things. Where facets are people, but part of the host so not whole individuals, and daemons are embodiments of the host but in a more created tulpa-ish way, so they're also part of the same person, and so on. Obviously there will be grey spots but keeping it simple is how I keep my head on straight. ^^;

    I'm glad I thought to ask a glossary question though. This site is called tulpa.io and it's inclusive and friendly to other plural types too (which I like), but they don't have as big a section on the info part of the site, so I feel like I don't know all I could, or should to be properly respectful. I'd hate to slander someone unintentionally. >.>
     
  18. AGGuy

    AGGuy Professional Pancake Multiple System Is a systemmate

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    Just a side note, by the way...

    "[Tri] We mainly use endogenic to replace "natural systems" since the latter has certain connotations. But we have seen it used other ways."
    <- That right there.
    a) I think finding good wordings for the difference between intentionally created and "natural" / it-sorta-just-happened systems would be good
    b) I think it would useful to have that as part of the user profile! It is pretty noteworthy information when describing the kind of system you're in, after all.

    Just as a lil' side note while we're on the topic.


    Greets,
    AG
     
  19. Rain

    Rain Administrator

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    For @Drakaina, this is a post written by Cassius on how we see "plurality" vs "multiplicity":
    It is because of Definition 2, and our stronger roots in the tulpamancy community, that we currently label ourselves "plural" instead of "multiple". However, considering that even Noctis was not created deliberately, and potential future involvement in multiple spaces, we may change that particular label back to "multiple".

    But first and foremost, we are mixed-origins.
     
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  20. AGGuy

    AGGuy Professional Pancake Multiple System Is a systemmate

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    @Rain Very useful, thank you for posting this.
    Rina and I definitely fit both definition one and two, so now I know for sure that it's the correct word for us.


    Greets,
    AG